Speaker 1 (00:00):
You know, do put yourself genuinely out there. You'll get genuine followers. Whether you've got 6 million or not, it doesn't matter, and then you'll enjoy it more.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Yes. This is the Bold Artist podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
You have answers, and you're expressing them in your art. Your art is important, and it needs to be seen.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Welcome. And let's get started with today's episode. Welcome back to the Bold Artist podcast. I'm here with my co-host, Charla Maarschalk, and today Charla has no idea what we're gonna talk about.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
It's true. I'm scared.
Speaker 2 (00:42):
I have a question and a topic to spring on you, Charla, and, and..
Speaker 1 (00:47):
Will this air? That's the question you want answered.
Speaker 2 (00:49):
I know you're gonna have something to say about it, and I know you're gonna wanna air it.
Speaker 1 (00:52):
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Okay. Here's the thing. On my feeds, my social feeds, I have actually been risk receiving like messages and content coming through my social feeds, which ironically enough, say that a lot of artists are getting off social media. I especially have this on my YouTube account where you know how algorithms work, and once they know like you've clicked on one thing, then it shows you, it inundates you with more of that content. Well, it seems like across my feed has been all of these messages of more and more artists saying I'm getting off Instagram, I'm getting off social media because they're just very unhappy with how the platform represents art, and the fact that you don't really own your art in your own account, the same way you would on a website or an email list. And the list goes on and on of all the reasons. I have been wondering what you think about this and how you, uh, guide your artists in Bold School to use social media. What kind of tool is it to you? How do you see it?
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Well, my first question is, like, where are they going?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
I think they're actually saying they're leaving Instagram, and they're promoting their own websites the best they can. And they are still using YouTube.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
Yeah. So, they're leaving social media, maybe staying on YouTube, promoting their website, but if their off of social media, how are they promoting themselves? Like there's nowhere to promote yourself except for paying and even paying, uh, with paid ads, they're going onto social media platforms to promote you as an artist. And I highly doubt they're leaving for paid ads. So, my first question, if somebody came to me and said that would be, like, where are you going? Because more than likely, and I'll do, I'm just putting words in their mouth, but more than likely they're not leaving the Internet and, and sitting at home running a, a big business. I would say more than likely, it's like a, um, what is it? A click bait. A click bait sentence that they're not actually leaving, especially if they're staying on YouTube. It means that YouTube is working for them and Instagram is not.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
And then there's other artists who have Instagram working for them, and YouTube is not working for them because every social media platform is different. You, you cannot go on LinkedIn and act the way that you do on YouTube. Yeah. Like you just can't. So, you have to be, you're different. Every platform is different. And as much as people say, you have to be on every single platform. I don't fully agree with that as a, an artist and a business owner, because you run yourself ragged if you do that. You just can't do all of that and run a successful business at the same time. You have to be able to hire people. And in order to hire people, you have to have a business that has enough cashflow to hire people. So, it's just not that simple to say, I'm either leaving all of social media, 'cuz you'll probably just, you know, be dead in the water, or you do it all, and you burn yourself out ,and it doesn't work anyways.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
One of the complaints that I heard or read when I clicked on one of these things, which is sure, which is, I'm sure why I'm getting more and more of it in my feed...
Speaker 1 (04:09):
'Cuz you clicked.
Speaker 2 (04:10):
um, the feeling like social media, and I guess I'll use Instagram, and by the way, I am an Instagramer. I love it. So, um, I prefer over the platform of Facebook, and, uh, I, so I'm not against it, but I, I do understand some of how the artists are feeling where it's very saturated with art, and your art just becomes a quick scroll. You know, you, you put all this time and energy into creating a piece and you post it with a lot of time and energy poured into what your caption and what your content says. And then it just becomes this quick scroll of entertainment, which is for the platform's benefit.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Not necessarily always for your benefit. And uh, a lot of artists are feeling like it's perhaps devaluing their work in time and becoming something that sucks them into, like they one described it, like feeling like a slave to social media.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
Speaker 2 (05:09):
where if you don't post enough, and you, you're not, if you're not interesting, and posting enough, and your feed doesn't look amazing, then um, then you go lower in the algorithm and you're not getting noticed. And it be, then you're even more of a slave because you're trying to get out of that, that low position.
Speaker 1 (05:29):
Speaker 2 (05:30):
And so, I did identify, I understood because, uh, it is a lot of work to maintain and keep your, um, your followers engaged. And so how do we manage that, being artists who wanna build our skill and get better at what we do and run businesses? Many of the artists listening here at the Bold Artist podcast have businesses in their art, and you can't, uh, feed the social media, um, hungry platform all the time while you're supposed to be working and running your business. So, how do we manage that? Do you have any tips?
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Yeah, it's um, I don't know if I have any tips, but I probably have tips. I just dunno if they're successful ones. But I think I, I feel the exact same way. I, in that respect I hate that aspect of social media, and I don't feed into it at all.
Speaker 2 (06:22):
That's what I like about you actually.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
I don't think I ever really have.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Yeah. That's what I like about you. That's why I actually wanted to ask you this question, because I've noticed that you swim against the stream a bit with the media.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
Yeah. I think what I would say to somebody, like an artist within our community asking the question, I would say the most important thing is to definitely have a website. You own that website. It's where you can control everything. You put all the information that's relevant to what kind of a business model you're running as an artist. You have your portfolio there, and um, you, you're in control of it, and you can send people there. And it's, you need that to look professionally. You need to know what, you need people to be able to look and see that you take this thing seriously. So, number one is to have your own website. And there's many ways you can go from there. You know, you can have a blog on your website, and with a lot of the templates right now, there's a lot you can add into a site and that can, can be your base.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
But from there, you have to be seen through Google search. So, you have to understand some of those, um, a lot of that tech if you wanna just have a website. But what I would advise is to have a couple of social, be on a couple of social media platforms, and have it there, because people wanna know that you are alive. You know, your website could have been done three years ago and never updated. It's really hard to tell unless you have your work on their categorized by the year. And even so, like, I get behind, I'm probably behind a year. I don't know if, when I last updated my website. But what people will be able to see when they go in your social media platform are regular posts, right? Even if it's just about your personal life. Even if you're not posting art or whatever. You're still posting, um, about life you're posting, whatever. Probably posting art, and people can see that you're alive and well. I think that's where you start, before you get drawn into how to brand yourself, or what kind of post, or what you need to write, or how to use reels, or whatever.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Just start there. Your website is that professional space where you can present to yourself, and your social media is your space where people can go and get to know your personality, and know that you are a working artist. You're working today.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Speaker 1 (08:36):
And you're not, you haven't just given up on life kind of thing, and put your art away. 'Cuz I anybody's gonna buy your art usually is, um, they wanna look at it as an investment. And if you're an artist that started last year and, and posted, and now you're not even painting anymore, tey're not gonna wanna buy your art. Usually, right? You know, and then, but if they see you've been working for 10 years, you're still working, that's already, um, a really big benefit to somebody who wants to buy your art. They can trust you, and your process, and your work that it's legitimate. They wanna know you're legitimate. So, social media kind of helps prove that you're legitimate.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Yes. That's such a good approach.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
That's the only thing it does. I think that's what it does.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Yes, that is a good approach. And I've also found that using it in such a way, well, like you mentioned, to pop in and, and say, I'm still here, and I still take this seriously. I'm alive. I love that approach. I also have had the experience as a follower that when I follow someone that I really love their work, and then they don't post, I am actually disappointed. And sometimes we, we forget that there's people behind all of this engagement. So, there's a real person behind who you're following. And then there's a real person behind who hits that double heart, like, and, and is actually engaging. And as the, the one who posts, like, posting on my account, I have to remember that it doesn't matter how many likes or how much engagement I get, but that there's a real person behind it.
Speaker 2 (10:11):
So, even if it's one person, the one right person that needed that post, then that's good enough. Uh, we don't have to depend on that algorithm to, you know, feed our egos. And then it's also the flip side where as the follower, I want the people that I'm, that I'm following to know, hey, I'm real. And I actually look forward to hearing from you, and I actually care about your art, and I care what you have to say about it. And I care how you're doing. I'm actually following you for a reason. And that is a side of the coin that I don't think gets talked about very much, because I'm super disappointed when people I love aren't posting and they sort of disappear from their accounts. And then I hear things like, oh, I'm gonna leave social media. And I'm like, mmm. But I was such a good follower. I'm trying.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
Yeah, you enjoy it.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Speaker 1 (11:04):
And how else are you gonna see into their lives, and see what they're doing, and get updates on their work? You know, it's...
Speaker 2 (11:09):
Speaker 1 (11:10):
You gotta look at it from a genuine, real perspective. And that's what you start to see. I know I've got friends and relative in different parts of the world, and they look forward to seeing what I'm doing. And uh, like the other day I put a post up, and I got texts from a couple of people commenting on my post via text.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Speaker 1 (11:29):
And I'm like, how come you didn't comment on the platform? But I don't mind.
Speaker 2 (11:32):
'Cause we got your number.
Speaker 1 (11:34):
Yeah. Um, but I just thought it was kind of fun because they are watching and they're reading and it's meaningful to them. So. I like to get those updates from people that I don't get to see all the time mm-hmm mm-hmm and I think even though we have strangers following us and they're following us for our art, it's the same thing.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
They enjoy it. They literally enjoy it. So, we, we get to post and, and allow people to consume our content who want to consume our content. And then, as a user, I think we gotta not feed -- try really hard -- to not feed into that beast that is social media where you scroll, scroll, scroll.
Speaker 2 (12:11):
Speaker 1 (12:11):
And you want something new? Like, like, like I want something better.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Speaker 1 (12:14):
You know, if you see, if you have an artist or a personality that you genuinely love, even if they have 6 million followers, take time to interact. Comment. Comments are one of the best things, you know?
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Let them know you care that they're there. Because even the most famous, uh, social media icon is gonna get discouraged at times because it does feel fake unless there's genuine interaction. And um.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Speaker 2 (12:40):
I think it's just really important to keep our comments real and engaging in, in that regard and yes.
Speaker 1 (12:47):
Yeah, definitely. Well, I get, when I get comments, if I put up a piece of art, sometimes I just get like 30 comments that are just emojis, and I appreciate the time that somebody's taken to comment, but I have no idea how to respond. Like, I don't really know why you're liking it or why there's a hot emoji or whatever, you know, like cool. Thanks. Yeah. But if somebody stops and actually writes a sentence, I stop and I read it and
Speaker 2 (13:15):
Yeah. Their time Involved, and their thought. They're engaging. So, I have...
Speaker 1 (13:19):
And I'll respond.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
I had seen, uh, someone posted something about how many years will you spend scrolling? And your phone will tell you your screen time and you can usually figure out how long you have scrolled in a day. And Steve and I, Steve's my husband, we did some math and figured out that like some people will spend four years of their life scrolling.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Like we, we figured out our age, like, ideal age span. I know that really got me thinking about being more intentional with my scrolling and how to maybe pare down some of... Now I wanna be a good follower and, and I wanna genuinely support people, but when you're scrolling through a lot that you follow, it's almost that I wanna pare down. So, that I'm really seeing, like, I'm choosing rather than the algorithm, who I'm seeing and appreciating. And that's becoming something I'm being more intentional about.
Speaker 2 (14:12):
And I used to feel like I needed to post something every day or people wouldn't follow or be engaged. And, and I'm feeling now there's been a transition where I'm really comfortable with posting once a week and maybe popping something into a story on Instagram every day, every other day. But I don't feel like a slave anymore. And sometimes, um, whereas at maybe at one point I did. I felt like to be a good business person, you had to have something on that art page every single day.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Speaker 2 (14:44):
And I don't feel that anymore. I love your approach to just using it as a tool to say, Hey, I'm alive. I appreciate you being here. And this is what I'm up to. Rather than feeling that it, that you need it to be your sales.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Yeah. I think sharing just your genuine self and you can choose what part it doesn't mean you have to be fully open and, and share your kids' stories and stuff like that on there. But deciding on what part of yourself you wanna be on social media with, and being genuine about it, it actually makes it a better experience for you. I, there's certain things I love posting about, like, I started posting in my stories other artists that I would find in my feed that I liked. Somebody that just really just caught my attention. Like the other day I saw the, you, you commented on it, the piece of clothing that was moving. And I was like, oh, this is so cool.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
I said, that's gonna be for your next Christmas party.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
Yeah, it was so cool.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
Speaker 1 (15:42):
It was interesting. So, I put it in my story. And when I first started doing that, I had the thought, oh, people are gonna get upset 'cause I'm not posting my own art, or they just wanna see my own art, or whatever. But that's just silly. I don't know what they actually wanna see, and it's not that I should or shouldn't care. But if I genuinely am putting myself, and my interests, and the things I'm doing up there, then the people who follow me are gonna be genuinely interested in what I like and what I'm interested in. If you're faking it, if you're, like, making, like, for instance, those dancing reels that came from the TikTok world,
Speaker 2 (16:18):
You haven't done a dancing reel yet, Charla?
Speaker 1 (16:20):
I am not gonna do a dancing reel. And everyone who I spoke to in social media is like, you should do it. Like, literally I've asked professionals and they're like, you need to do the dancing reels. I'm like, no, I'm not doing it. I think I can succeed without doing a dancing reel.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
Speaker 1 (16:34):
So, my thought is that okay, I actually went through my head. If I was gonna do dancing reels, how would I do it? I would have to drink wine at 7:00 AM in order to get up the nerve to do it. And I would have to film them all in one day, and then maybe I'd have a month of content, and then I'd have to do it again. And all of a sudden I'm like dreading my life. Like. I don't wanna it. And even though we have to always do things we don't like doing um, that's just a part, if we're gonna run a business, there's work involved.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
But I realized that that would be, I would be selling myself out. It would be dreadful and awful. And I would hate every second of me dancing. Not because I thought I looked stupid, but because I was selling myself, I was selling out. It's not me. It's not what I'm into. And so I just made the decision. I am not going to dance on Instagram.
Speake 2 (17:22):
Speaker 1 (17:23):
And next week I'll probably post a dancing reel, and everybody will call me out on it. But you know, do put yourself genuinely out there. You'll get genuine followers. Whether you've got 6 million or not, it doesn't matter, and then you'll enjoy it more.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
Speaker 1 (17:36):
And you don't have to feed that algorithm if you don't want to. Yes.
Speaker 2 (17:40):
I do know that taking a professional approach to your Instagram page... So, you're, you have art that you wanna produce or you want to promote and have be professional, and have that professional presence, it has helped me to use, uh, a third party platform such as Later or Planoly to sit down once a week and type out the post and schedule them.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Speaker 2 (18:04):
That has really helped. But I only, like suggest that for someone who, who wants to take that approach, because I don't think we have to be a slave to that, or feel like our businesses depend on that. There's been seasons of my life, where I felt like I needed to just liberate myself to like post when I want to and no guilt, no, no social media guilt. And then there's been other seasons of my life where I'm like, okay, I have the time, space and energy that on this morning, I'm gonna sit down and make a month's worth of posts that are all planned in the third party app that alerts me, Hey, make your post, it's all ready to go.
Speaker 2 (18:42):
And boom, it's easy. It's, it's already thought out. I don't have to give time and head space to that every single day that I post. And so I, I do like that suggestion, but I say it cautiously because I don't ever want an artist to feel like they have to be a slave to posting because that's not what being an artist is about. Um, we,
Speaker 1 (19:04):
Speaker 2 (19:04):
We can't like make our artwork for the purpose of social media, unless that is your, unless that is your target, perhaps it is. But for me it is, it isn't my personal goal as an artist to be a, like, social media star with my art. So...
Speaker 1 (19:22):
Well, there's a meme that you've probably seen, and it's, uh, the artist painting the Mona Lisa. And he's like, look at what I've, I've spent four years of my life on this piece. And then there's the guy next to him in like the next comic frame. And he's like, I just painted one piece and posted it. And it's 10 minutes later and I gotta post another piece piece. I gotta paint another piece to post. You know, like,
Speaker 2 (19:45):
Speaker 1 (19:45):
And that's what social media's like. They're expecting you to have a fresh painting every day.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
Speaker 1 (19:49):
That's almost, I know people are doing it, it's but for many artists that's impossible. For me, that's impossible. Well, I have felt that pressure before. Especially because I do a lot in the world of illustration, and illustration tends to be a little bit faster. And so there are a lot of illustrators who can produce pieces every day or, or memes every day or little like inspirational quotes that they illustrate. And I have felt the pressure like Marijanel, why can't you do that? And I'm someone who who's quite capable. I can do a lot of things. And so that kind of pressure falls on me and I'm like, I should be able to do that, too. And that isn't, I just don't think that that's healthy. And artists need to find the space, and the relationship with social media where you're healthy, and asking yourself like, what can I do, and what feeds my soul joy? Um, there's times I'll be honest that I just really just wanna sit down and scroll for a half an hour. And that's what I do make a cup of coffee, and I scroll. And I wanna be able to do that without guilt because I'm a, a doer, and I don't wanna waste my life scrolling, but at the same time, I, sometimes we need that. And then other times we, I need to take a break. And I need to be like, this week, uh, I'm gonna take that app right off my phone, 'cuz I need to concentrate on something different. And we need to have the freedom to do that, too.
Speaker 1 (21:12):
Yeah, definitely. I think there's just, there's so many, um, stories out there about how to use it, why to use it. There's so many opinions. I shouldn't say stories 'cuz Instagram has stories. Uum, it's, it depends on what you're trying to achieve.
New Speaker (21:25):
New Speaker (21:26):
And in business is, if you're starting a business, running a business, then you need to figure out how to make social work media work for you, and decide if you're going to be just simply selling on social media. 'Cuz there are quite a few different business models you can follow to have a social media business, and people do it successfully. And you work that into your model, and you work that to your daily routines in life, and who you hire and stuff like that. But then there's other models, as well. Um, I think any business requires work and requires planning and not comparing yourself to somebody else because they might be doing something different.
Speaker 1 (22:05):
I know some artists who have made their entire livelihood on social media, but then I know artists who sponsor ads, they pay, pay to have their art, um, advertised, and they sell that way. They sell prints or whatever that way. There's lots of ways. And YouTube is another way that you can get paid for your work. But YouTube is a different beast than Instagram. You have to be totally different person to make it on YouTube. So, it's, it's what you wanna put in. It's what you wanna get out. You know, we can't just be pressured by what other people are doing when it doesn't fit into our life. But we also had to be brave.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Speaker 1 (22:42):
And take steps forward in doing things we don't understand. And a lot of people get off social media 'cuz they don't understand it. They feel pressure, they think they have to dance on TikTok, and they, they think that it's the right thing to say is that I'm just gonna leave.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Speaker 1 (22:57):
But they're probably not really gonna get anywhere by leaving. I think you just need to decide what your goals are and then put the work in the right model.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Speaker 2 (23:07):
Speaker 1 (23:07):
Where you're going.
Speaker 2 (23:08):
You've touched on two things. I hope I remember them 'cuz I wanna, I wanna speak to both of them, but you touched on two things that stood out to me. Um, just now the word being brave, there are a lot listening like you and I are, are talking about maybe not feeling like a slave to social media or not feeling like you have to do it all, but there's some that just wanna be a little braver and they're not having the same challenge that we are. And they're just saying, but I'm just trying to get up the guts to make a post and put it out there. And to you, I want to say that is part of being a bold artist is being willing to press that post button and taking the brave steps to do that.
Speaker 2 (23:52):
And you will find that there will be followers and people who truly appreciate, like I said earlier in the podcast that really want to see you and your style and what you have to offer. I don't believe is too oversaturated for your work. I, I think the world, as we even say here, and.
Speaker 1 (24:10):
Speaker 2 (24:11):
in the opening of the Bold Artist podcast, the world needs your work.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Yes. A hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
And so, I do wanna speak to those who are listening and they're like, well, sounds like you girls have a whole different problem because I just kind of don't even know how to start my Instagram page or my Instagram account. And, and I encourage you to take the steps, if that's what you want to do, to take the steps,
Speaker 1 (24:34):
Yeah, do it.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
to be brave enough to do it. And um, yes. And...
Speaker 1 (24:40):
Yeah. There's a book I, one I was gonna mention earlier and I forgot, there's a book, um, I don't even remember exactly what it's called, but it's something along the lines of your, Your Thousand True Followers, or something like that. You and he, I think it's a, he, I don't even know who, who wrote it. It's right off the top of my head. But the book talks about all you need is a thousand true followers to have a successful business or successful life or whatever. Um, and that means like that person who truly enjoys your work genuinely is moved by your work and will moved enough to speak, moved enough, to follow moved enough to purchase. And you've got a business. And it's not as easy as it sounds. A thousand seems like a small number when you're thinking about social media followers. It doesn't mean you get a thousand followers, they're true.
Speaker 1 (25:27):
But you going, you're looking for a thousand people in the run of your career that truly genuinely love what you do. And that, um, is enough, right? We think in the social media world, we need a million followers or a hundred thousand followers. And uh, like what is enough? What are we going after that number? But if you're looking at there's this really small group of people out there meant to find my, my work and find me, I'm just trying to find them. So, in the realm of that, you might get followers, you'll lose followers. People will complain. People won't like what you do. But then you'll find those true followers.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Speaker 1 (26:06):
And that's what you're out there or for. And that's what the effort is. That's why the effort is worth it. That's your goal is to find the people that are meant to find you. So, if you don't do it, they can't find you.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Speaker 1 (26:18):
They won't, it's just a hundred percent impossible. If you leave social media, or you never post, they'll never find you in this world right now.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Speaker 1 (26:25):
But if you put yourself out there, they get to find you.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Speaker 1 (26:29):
I love thinking that way because there's people out there that I am better for because I found them.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
Speaker 1 (26:34):
So, I'm so happy. They put themselves out there.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
Speaker 1 (26:36):
For me to find.
Speaker 2 (26:36):
Absolutely. And putting yourself out there in a way that is a healthy balance for you. And that was the second thing I wanted to speak to is how you touched on that you don't think we have to be on every single platform out there. So, you might wanna try different platforms and see which one feels most authentic and organic to you. Because they do have different personalities. As Charla's mentioned, like, Facebook has a different vibe and feel, and Instagram has this flavor, and YouTube's a whole other animal, but one of them might just really gel and be your thing. And you could kind of nurture the others and make a post to say, Hey, I'm alive. But one of them really takes off for you. And I've had that in my experience, as well. And I just find certain environments online are more suited, for my visual style, my personal preference of how people interact.
Speaker 2 (27:28):
And so there's freedom in that. And I think that's what I really wanted to, to hear about and talk about today was just that, uh, having initially when I shared having all those, uh, artists pop up in my feed saying, we're getting offline, we're getting off this platform, and we're doing this. And we, we don't like we, we are against the algorithm and, and too much saturation in the market. And I was saying, but I like you here. And I love the art community online. And do we have to leave it to find the balance? Like, do we have to cut ourselves off in order to find where we fit in that space? Um, or a good balance in the space. So. Thanks for having this talk with me and let me surprise you with the topic.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
It's a good one.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Speaker 1 (28:17):
And we went a while, so and could probably go longer. It's a really good, every evolving topic.
Speaker 2 (28:22):
Speaker 1 (28:23):
Definitely 'cuz social media is ever evolving.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
It is, it changes all the time.
Speaker 1 (28:25):
I think that's why people ultimately get frustrated because it's always changing.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
New Speaker (28:30):
And just as you figure it out, it changes. So.
Speaker 2 (28:32):
Speaker 1 (28:32):
it's just what it is.
Speaker 2 (28:33):
'Cause for those of us who started on Instagram quite a while ago, it was really just posting and videos. And now it's stories and reals and IGTV was a thing for a while, but it's not anymore. And.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
Speaker 2 (28:46):
And you can also go live, which I was gonna say, it seems at the moment, the algorithm really favors people who go live. And so that's a whole other thing.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Good for them. Good for those live people.
Speaker 2 (28:56):
Like we're live right now. We're, you know, on the fly. But there's a lot of people and personalities in the world who don't feel like they have what it takes to, to go live with an audience. And I wanna say that that's okay. These, these certain, these platforms and the media can't make you do anything, and you don't have to do anything. Even if it's the way you think you'll find followers. You, you do have to, to be in that space in the way you're most comfortable. I heard a lot
Speaker 1 (29:28):
But you might love it.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
You might. You might find your thing.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Sometimes. Yeah. Like I think sometimes your greatest fear is like a cover for the thing that you are going to be really good at and really love.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
See, Charla balances me out. I say you don't have to, there's liberation here. And Charla's like, but,
Speaker 1 (29:46):
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Face your fear.
New Speaker (29:47):
You won't know till you try. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
You won't know. So you gotta try live to know you're not good at alive, and you might love alive, and then you be dancing live on Instagram. So, Charla, let's talk about that fear of, of the dancing reels.